1.8T seems to be overheating for no real reason...

Discussion in '1.8 & 1.8T' started by HidRo, Sep 2, 2017.

  1. Nige

    Nige Paid Member Paid Member

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    imo your AFR is too lean at idle.

    In MY experience with an ABF, I find idling at 12.5 or so gives a much more stable idle and that may also affect engine temps. Try increasing the fuelling in the cells at idle and lowering the temperatures at the same time...
     
  2. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    A 20v engine has very different burn rates to an older ABF engine. In fact very stable at 'lean' exhaust mixtures of between 0.95 to 1.03 lambda and 900rpm. A 16v has no chance of achieving similar stability at those mixture strengths or idle speed.
     
  3. Nige

    Nige Paid Member Paid Member

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    I thought that could be the case, but mentioned it incase that was a factor :thumbup:
     
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  4. HidRo Forum Member

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    I can give it a go and go from 14ish to 13ish to see if it makes any difference.
     
  5. Nige

    Nige Paid Member Paid Member

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    how did it go today?
     
  6. HidRo Forum Member

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    Ah, I meant to have a feedback here already, but didn't manage to get the movies up (youtube decided to remove the movie maker from the site, which was a very easy way to have things done).

    So, report:
    It was a good trackday, managed to drop 1s to my best time but only when I was alone (it was the last session as well). Did a 2.09.94.

    Issues...
    The water temp raised up to 108C at the last session.
    It was 99, 106, 102 on the other sessions.
    MAT was 39, 42, 45 and 46 on each of the 4 session.
    This was with around 28C maximum outside temps.

    I had an exhaust leak I could hear, but could not identify where, and instead of doing 0.8bar it was doing 0.66 and instead of high boost 1.5bar, it was doing 1.2bar.

    So, still not perfect for the water I would say. MAT is really good I believe.

    Oil temps, whenever I looked, was at around 86 etc. So not over 100 for sure. The sensor is the one corresponding to the cluster.
    Could it be due to the low position of the sump?

    The car it self, "boats" around a bit. I believe I'll need stiffer springs. Going any lower than it is will get the a-arms pointing up, which is not good. I locked the damp setting to the max, and was ok with it, but the rocking movement is still very noticeable.
    I might test some front coilover springs in the rear, stiffing the rear a bit.

    Other than that, good fun!
     

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  7. Tristan

    Tristan Paid Member Paid Member

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    I had a G60 mk1 here with similar overheating, throwing out the coolant at idle. Yet running cold on the road. I changed to the spherical header tank, improved a little, then I raised it from the original position about 25-30 mm and all issues disappeared.

    I'd recommend that on your car, purely from a future proofing point of view, the round tanks and cap are better than the ce1 style you have.

    Re thermostats, you MUST run one, or a restrictor of some type, the cooling system needs a bit of back pressure to work properly.

    Re ignition timing, retarded timing will cause hotter running.
     
  8. HidRo Forum Member

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    This screenshot is where I pull 4th and 5th gear.
    Timing will be around 19/20 degrees. I believe that is not that retarded.
    At idle if anything, it's advanced.

    I have lowered by 1cm give or take the tank, to be able to use the strut bar. Would that impact that much the system?
    I am running a t-stat, 82-102C one.


    Btw, I might need to change from the stock'ish radiators to aluminum ones?
    Are there any recommendations?
    I'm running the stock like one from Nissins and it's 625mm long.
    There is one on ebay that is 540mm long.
    aluminum radiator for VW CORRADO SCIROCCO JETTA GOLF GTI MK2 1.8 16V 1986-1992 | eBay
    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/aluminum-...144809?hash=item3aeb801c69:g:AekAAOSwoydWidsq
    It seems there are now some others available, with the bigger size:
    Race Aluminium Radiator VW MK 1 MK 2 Golf 8V GTI, 1.8 Carb & Scirocco 1.8 GLI
    http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Race-Alum...424842?hash=item236a21558a:g:4YsAAOSwoJZXRv2a

    Is this anything to look at?

    Anything else?
     

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    Last edited: Oct 5, 2017
  9. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    Where is the boosted part of that ignition table?
     
  10. HidRo Forum Member

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    Hi!
    It's in the MSL screenshot, but here it is.
    I can even share the MSQ if you want. Not sure I can do it through the forum directly as an attachment though.
     

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  11. HidRo Forum Member

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  12. HidRo Forum Member

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  13. HidRo Forum Member

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    @Nige, where do you check your Oil temp? Do you have a sensor sending information to MS to datalog? Or is it a gauge?
    If a sensor dataloging in MS, which one are you using?
    Thanks!
     
  14. HidRo Forum Member

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    So, still to be identified fully, but it seems that miraculously it was resolved.
    The only thing we changes was a pipe that should go to the heater core and then back, that we deleted in the past. But it might have been some issue there, not allowing the flow to move freely. Now, with a better pipe, the car will idle up to 94, fans kick in, and drops to 90. So it's perfect.
    Will have to test this some more, but I had not time to add the oil cooler...
    So let's see how it behaves.

    I just hope it does not rain next Sunday. :p If it does, there will be a lot of dancing [:D]
     
  15. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    Glad to here it is sorted for now.
     
  16. HidRo Forum Member

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    Trackday done.
    It was nice. Lot's of rain in the morning, cleared in the afternoon.
    Temps were always good on track, but whenever I stopped, it would raise up to 100+...
    On track, between 92C and 96C. Stopped to talk to a friend for 2m, and raised from 92C to 100C...
    So it behaves better pulling hard than idling.
    A friend said that might be a crack in the block or in the head.
    track.jpg

    Video of this happening.
    You can see coasting down the pitlane it went down to 90C, and then quickly raising to 100C+ while idling.
    [video=youtube;R3YinKZs6k4]https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R3YinKZs6k4[/video]
     
    Last edited: Mar 20, 2018
  17. HidRo Forum Member

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    So, coming back to this.
    Changed the Radiator to a Toyota Celica one, like Nige has.
    Added an Oil Cooler, 16 rows.
    The temps were perfect, but I see a behavior that is rather strange...
    The water flow should be going from the radiator, to the t-stat, through the block, and out the flange on the side, into the radiator again, right?

    But I see that the water temp on the sensor goes lower than the t-stat, meaning that the water is flow backwards?
    The t-stat should close out at 82C or something, and I see temps low as 73C when hammering it on the straights.
    Picture from MegaLogViewer to ilustrate it.


    [​IMG] [​IMG] [​IMG]
     

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