1990 KR on blue smoke

Discussion in '16-valve' started by Southside, Jan 29, 2021.

  1. Southside Paid Member Paid Member

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    So just brought the car yesterday and it's smoking bad. I drove it back on an 100mile trip and I had to top up the oil with 2ltrs during the journey as the oil pressure light came on. From reading on site and net, stem valve seals or worst case piston rings. Now I've always wanted to rebuild an engine myself but I don't have the space and with working, I'm only going to have evenings weekends. Do you think it's a big job and how long do you think it would take in hours?

    2nd option would be to get someone to do it. I'm based in London so any recommendations would be helpful and rough costs?
     
  2. costel1969

    costel1969 Paid Member Paid Member

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    If you haven’t done work like this before then I don’t recommend that you take this on - from your original post it would appear that there is definitely significant wear be it valve seals and or pistons.
    Can’t give a price on this myself but price will depend on how much work has to be done - top end, bottom end or both.
    Is your buddy a mechanic? If so then that would be a better option and hopefully a bit cheaper (mates rates)
    Someone on here should chirp in with shop recommendations in London - I’m Canada based so I don’t have visibility on this.
     
  3. Rustbuster

    Rustbuster Paid Member Paid Member

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    You could do a few checks first before pulling the motor. Compression test or better still if you have a compressor a leak down test that’ll help identify if it’s the rings and worth pulling the motor. There are good tutorials for both on YouTube and gauges are relatively inexpensive. Also consider an oil pressure check. These may save you pulling the motor out unnecessarily if it is valve stem oil seals which will just be a head removal and a lot more straightforward. I believe valve stem oil seals can be replaced without even removing the head on some motors but not sure if that’s the case with 16v KR motor?
    If it does come to a full rebuild do you have the tools? I’ve never done a full rebuild but like your thoughts on doing it yourself. Would be a great learning process and very satisfying IF, all goes to plan.
     
  4. Southside Paid Member Paid Member

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    So I had a friend have a look at it over the weekend. He thinks it might be the stem valve seals but he didn't carry out any tests to confirm. Before I give anyone the go ahead, what tests should I get done to try and determine costs? I just want to be sure that I'm making the right decision to repair/rebuild or would it be cost effective just to buy another engine and replace? @Rustbuster thank for suggesting the tests. Anyone know if the stem oils seals can be replaced without taking the head out?
     
  5. costel1969

    costel1969 Paid Member Paid Member

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    You will need to remove the head for the stem seals - as per Rustbuster above, get a compression test done, if your buddy can get a tester it's a quick and easy test and will tell you what cylinder(s) are in trouble.

    The 1.8 engines are pretty robust and if I was to bet, I would think it's the head (stems seals) rather than down low in the block (pistons) presuming that this car got some degree of care/maintenance (regular servicing/oil changes) during it's lifetime.

    You can get another engine and do a straight swap but by the same token you need to be sure that it's a known good engine and can be seen and heard running as otherwise you could wind up in a similar position.
     
  6. Southside Paid Member Paid Member

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    So I'm really considering to this myself. I'm going to do the compression test this weekend and then I'll have a better idea what I'm dealing with. One question I had was if I needed to do the piston rings, would I need to remove the whole engine or can this be done from underneath? Also the clutch needs doing. Would I be better off taking the whole engine out?
     
  7. cupracraig

    cupracraig Paid Member Paid Member

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    i would say it sounds like a perfect time to have the engine reconditioned if you have the funds
     
  8. costel1969

    costel1969 Paid Member Paid Member

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    If you are in a position to take the engine out, then I would. Do you have any gear for that? - engine crane, stand, pit/lift etc. I don't recommend trying to do this off of axle stands for a number of reasons - safety being the most important. If you do decide to take the engine out, apart from the repairs, it will give you an opportunity to clean or paint the engine along with generally inspecting and or cleaning/degreasing the engine bay, wiring etc.
     
    Last edited: Feb 8, 2021
  9. Southside Paid Member Paid Member

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    If I can't borrow the bits needed to remove the engine, then I'll buy 2nd hand and use that. When stripping down, would it be beneficial to mark like how the ignition distributor is fitted and say how the cams are lined up or does this get setup from scratch as part of the rebuild? I would label/picture and even record everything just so I have a note but what are the main things to mark up?
     
  10. costel1969

    costel1969 Paid Member Paid Member

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    Yes, recommend you take plenty of photographs and mark up all electrical connectors/plug-ins etc. regardless of whether you do an engine swap or rebuild the existing head/block. If you are doing a swap then you will be re-timing everything when installing the exchange unit. There are threads on the site regarding timing marks and set-up etc. just do a quick search and you will find them.
    My old rule of thumb when pulling an engine out was loads of photos and unless something is absolutely obvious on where it goes/connects to - label it up and avoid the guesswork later
     
  11. Southside Paid Member Paid Member

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    so I've been thinking more and more about this rebuild. I keep reading stuff about getting the cylinder head ported and flowed, crankshaft and block polished. Are all these things necessary? I mean once they're out, I'll give them a good clean and take as much crap off them but why do plp go the extra mile? I'm not looking to gain or add any extra power tbh
     
  12. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    all comes down to what you want out of it. a standard refurb is all you need if you're not fussed about tuning the engine at all :)
     
  13. costel1969

    costel1969 Paid Member Paid Member

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    You've answered your own question here - if you have no interest in upping power then stick to the standard refurbishment and away you go. If you start going down the ported / polished route, next thing is an uprated camshaft, then a bigger block and then you're praying for a lottery win to finance it all - that stuff gets very expensive very fast. Apart from generally cleaning things up, I do recommend painting the engine block with suitable black engine paint - it makes a fine job of things.
     
  14. Southside Paid Member Paid Member

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    perfect! Just need to read up now on a how to remove the engine? The clutch needs replacing so I need the gearbox to come out as well. I guess it makes sense to remove this as one unit right?
     
  15. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    yeah I would pull it all out together, the whole front panel can be removed which makes life real easy. when undoing front bumper put a jack under front engine carrier as sometimes the bolts that hold it to the rad carrtier rot out, and these are the only things that hold the engine up once bumper is off. apart from that its basically undo stuff till you can remove it, pretty simple job on a mk2. when splitting gearbox there is a hidden 19mm bolt underneath round the back, going from engine side into the box near CV joint. easy to miss!
     
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  16. Southside Paid Member Paid Member

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    what should I be looking at replacing apart from the obvs - valve stem seals, piston rings and clutch? I guess all the gaskets will need replacing plus I 'll do the timing belt and water pump.

    Just want to have a parts list so I can start shopping around :)
     
  17. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

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    looking at the original post again, if its smoking as bad as that perhaps its a blocked breather or overfilled oil, check the plastic dipstick guide tube is intact and remove all the block breather pipe work from the front for a good clean up. there should be a little mesh ball pushed up the breather at the airbox end so have a feel around the hose till you find it and see if you can pull it out for a good clean. while there check the airbox, if its coated in oil then this is also a clue
     
  18. Southside Paid Member Paid Member

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    Thanks @rubjonny. I'll have a look at this over the weekend
     
  19. Southside Paid Member Paid Member

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    @rubjonny checked the breather pipe and not blocked. Looks like the pipe has been replaced recently and I couldn't find the mesh either. Opened the air box and had very little oil in there. I've got another post on this group where I've posted the compression figures
     

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