Drake engine pictures,

Was looking through photobucket and found these, no harm to re host here again as they are golden. Ill let pictures do the talking!

Some of you Im sure have seen them before,

 

And the reason why the head is in too parts - save me typing it a second time ,

Left hand paragraph,



Drake specs,





Brian,

 

Nice porn Brian!

 

creamed

 

Here's all 93 Drake photo's.


http://s975.photobucket.com/user/Fray16v/slideshow/Drake Engineering Album

 

lovely well engineered piece of American technology,
you can see its built to flow .was the dogs in day

but since then I think technology has moved on, and similar power results can be obtained from a stock head reworked by the right people matched to custome pistons ,

ive seen 2 litre ottenger engines been out gunned on the rollers by a well sorted brm engine .

be very interesting to see a drake set up on a modern dyno , if the owner would be brave enough , bloo dy expensive even could find one for sale .

luvely piece of kit , enjoyed looking at it , cheers paul

 

They were well engineered for they'r time and 280bhp is still a lot of power for NA even by today's standard's.

http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?5225098-Drake-16v-heads-for-sale

 

think they were for sale at one point , but at a silly price , be nice to find out though , even better to send them to china and have them copied, bet they would do a good job to lollollol.

 

I reckon we should all chip in, buy the bits needed, and set up a cgti buisness with brian g technical genius to copy and remake

 

Like your think Rob although I'm hoping that the Fsi head turns out to be a commercial possibility as a conversion on to a 1.8 or 2.0 ltr block, it's dependent on the amount of work required. Won't be cheap but cheaper and more plentiful than a Drake! Won't of course have the historic appeal but when it's spinning at 9k who cares

The Fsi head will flow enough for at least 280bhp on std valve sizes and doesn't require extensive port work. Will make a cracking race and track day N/A engine on the older, strong and plentiful block.

The more I look at it the simpler it seems.

Need a decent rocker cover and inlet manifold cast. The rest should be off the shelf (sort of).

 

I couldnt care less how we get there either, but we need something like this to take it to the pugs....they have 300hp.....we dont have enough. Its only a matter of time before more duratec fiestas get built also.

Thing is, I reckon going forwards 300hp will be only just enough.....hence me being in advanced discussions about 1.4T, but I'm still not convinced it will work with FWD

 

I think the more Important thing to do is break test the alloy bottom ends. Break test being test until they go in bits then improve what broke.

That way, we wouldn't need to separate the head from its oem block, and we could finally forget about the older cast iron blocks in terms of Fsi heads.

Apart from anything though, money today is non existent, and people just wont spend big on r+d or bespoke parts anymore which is sad. Even if ya did put 1-2 months developing a cast intake manifold, its impossible forecast if anyone would even buy one.

 

I looked at 1.4t but dismissed it as I reckon you need 4WD to make it work, was talking to Colin Satchell about that recently. Could go to a rallye or syncro chassis but I just like FWD. You look at the super 1600's in rallying. They could beat anything on the right roads.

Colin was saying the Dynalynx Quattro is hugely fast but is probably beatable depending on circuit/conditions etc. I know they beat it at Mallory in the wet but they are under no illusions that in the dry it would walk away on the straights.

I started off thinking 270 bhp would be ok but even even Colin, and his guys, were saying they needs more power, and they have 283bhp now!

As you say 300bhp has to be the aim. I have a box and shafts that will take it now so i just need to build the engine, and an ABF is never going to make that power, not with the sorts of budgets we have at our disposal at our level.

I'm confident that I can build an Fsi cylinder head based motor that will make 300bhp, mainly because it only has to hold together for a few minutes at a time. I'd be less c onfident if I had to make it hold together for a race or rally distance!

I'm dropping one of my Fsi head castings of with Jason at JMR when we meet up at Wiscombe in a few weeks to start on it. Jasons having a go in it on the Sunday to see how his latest 8v head is going - don't think he'll be disappointed. However it will be a wake-up call as Colin said he's going to be out as well. I love watching that car, can't wait to get the engine built now - need to sell the 8v to fund it though, which is a shame as I really like the 8v and I'd rather keep it for a fast road car but needs must .

 

Tony, that all sounds very interesting, so keep us posted. I must call over to Jason someday for a general chat and sitdown.

Im sure you all saw these. Old tech here, but boys oh boys!

[video=youtube;8sXTq6SpEB8]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=8sXTq6SpEB8[/video]

[video=youtube;TakF5y0X0qo]http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=TakF5y0X0qo[/video]

Just had a look on ebay there at FSi heads. Can someone give me an engine cc and code as to what the 'best' head is? Im thinking of buying one soon for further study.

I had a great insight 2 months ago when I bought an F1 head. I chopped it up and found some very cool architecture inside. The methods of oiling are also great, as were the pneumatic valves and general coolant location above the chamber.

I plan to display it all online now soon - gave the article to Racecar Engineering initially to try get back some money(Chopping up F1 stuff gets expensive fast) It was the first time pneumatic valve actuation had EVER been discussed or taken photos of a real system(not a pretend company show mockup ) so it was and still is a pretty exciting bit of r+d work. The engine was an 850hp v10. Regardless at all of the port shapes, the learning got from methods used to spin cams at 8krpm is to be noted.

I signed a deal with the editors that I could show nothing online until a month had passed after the Mag month ending hence the delay in sharing the info. Im 2 weeks in the clear now so Im chipping away at the full thread for an hr or two every evening for the past few days. Its a big one.

Im using this info for mainly my own research for my own head design in the future, I dont mind sharing the info now that I got a few quid for it. I believe info and knowledge should be shared for everyone to see. If only one other guy wanted to build his own head then all the trouble is worth it in terms of presenting the info to him.
Some may think any head could be modded to match one that could be made, and Im sure they are correct. But it is a personal dream Ive had since a child so I have to see it through.

Brian,

 

I was under the impression that the fsi head had very small dia followers which preclude the use of big cams????

There is a very good cyl head company in sweden who i have had some very interesting discussions with, along the lines of what would it take to make a top end race head for 'old' 2l vw blocks, 300hp potential. Cos there has to be a global market for such a product right? With the number of rabbits and golfs racing.....run some numbers, think buisness case etc. Well, approx 100k to develop and produce a bolt on head and cam package. So if you could sell these for 5K apiece, you would have to sell 20. Feels like that might be possible to me, globally. But like Brian says, its one hell of a financial gamble!

 

Its fairly straight forward to bore them bigger on most heads, or even offset bore them if they start to touch in the middle. I have no clue what a bucket carrier of an Fsi head looks like though.

Edit, roller followers - I get ya, thought some were bucket?!

 

Im starting to think anyone that races old vws wont have 5k to spend on anything.

The other killer is regs, could you enter a race with a head that modified and non vw part?

Brian,

 

You can in hillclimbing, heads are free. But how applicable this is in worldwide series is anyones guess, making sizing any potential market difficult. But there are aftermarket mini heads, pinto heads, crossflow heads, mgb, volvo, jag, etc etc etc. given the number of vags racing successfully, i am constantly amazed at the general lack of off the shelf hot-up parts.

Yes things like this cost a lot, but so does making / developing your own, and sometimes its a false economy.

 

Thats interesting Rob, the other aspect/addition to the cost is an equally expensive bottom end. Steel crank/uber rods, one off pistons to go with head etc. This all increases risk of the bottom ending being spec'd wrong and the lot going up making 10ks worth of a bang. Maybe throwing pistons in with the head package would be a good idea.

I guess some do spend this on an engine though, and know what they are doing.

Brian,

 

10k for a 300hp engine dyno'd and ready to go is not an unreasonable sum at all.

Check these guys out

http://www.motordesign.se/