Driveshaft lengths (bare driveshaft lengths) ** wanted **

Discussion in 'Transmission' started by RobT, Feb 2, 2008.

  1. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    Great info :thumbup:

    Based on this, Mk1 Golf 90mm shafts should be 8mm longer than 100mm per side (250 - 234 = 16 divide by 2).

    So far we have:

    So:

    • the 90mm short shaft number looks nigh-on at 8.5mm
    • the 90mm long shaft number looks correct at 8mm
     
  2. danster Forum Addict

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    Hi Chris, Passat shafts are defintely 4 stud type as I stripped the std TDI passat myself.

    The 90mm and 100mm shaft length differences on a mk2 golf are close to 8mm but may be slightly less if I remember correctly. 6mm comes to mind but that may be imprinted in my memory from the haynes manual which is not always correct. Still pretty close dimension wise for anyone considering options.

    The list is getting there now and shows some useful info for folks with mk2 & 3s interested in widetracking options.

    For the record I worked out that anyone wanting to widetrack a mk1 platform vehicle, the use of mk2 & 3 platform shafts is possible if the engine and gearbox is moved 8mm towards the nearside. This equalises the difference in shaft lengths and offset of the engines between mk1 versus mk2 & 3 platforms.
    This is very useful when using the more modern engines that have the long nose crank and chain drive oil pump as it gives more room at the o/s engine mount / chassis leg, and the fact that the 02A / J gearbox is shorter than the 020 causes no issues at the nearside either.
    There is another way without requiring the engine and box to be moved by using another mix of shafts depending on width required.
    This is getting close to giving away how I did mine!;)
     
  3. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    Great - all info updated in post 80 :thumbup:

    I still have no idea!
     
  4. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Admin

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    the only possible fly in the ointment is apparently the MK2 scirocco with 100mm flanges under certain circumstances uses MK2 shafts. This is what ETKA says anyway, how accurate this is remains to be seen. Inner C/Vs are different on KR and 8v nmodels on both scirocco and MK2s also, yet actual shafts on the MK2 apparently are sometimes the same for both 8v and 16v models. It's all very confusing. I have a couple of txt files containing shaft & cv part numbers, but I dont know if it should be put in here or maybe another thread...
     
  5. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    Is there a chance these part nos are cross reffing back to the same physical item?

    Looking at the scale of info we've now got, short 100mm Scirocco and Mk2 Golf are within 1mm, which for the purposes of this thread is "the same", but the long shafts are way different.

    Hypothetically, with the 250mm flange-to-flange measurement Danster's done, if we take a shaft of a different length from a Mk2 golf and put it in a Scirocco, the inner CV will not run in the centre of the bearing unless something else changes. By elimination, the wishbone, ball joint, strut etc all being the same means the outer CV would then have to alter - there's nothing else to give.

    Thoughts? We may as well get to the bottom of this.
     
  6. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Admin

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    one of the things I've thought of, is the early MK1 boxes didnt use 2x green slieve things for the flange oil seal, if you know what I mean. the later boxes are basically MK2 boxes, I guess this might explain the disparency?

    I hesitate to take anything ETKA says as 'fact' especially when it seems to go against what we know. it is often the case that ETKA is wrong, or just isnt filling us in on the full story about why a certain part is so.

    for example, according to ETKA, no MK3s ever had MK2 size rear beam bushes, but we know for a fact this can be the case.
     
  7. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    Wouldn't the earlier ones be 90mm, or are there some non-Mk2 ones at 100mm?
     
  8. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Admin

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    all the earlier MK1 based models had 90mm flanges, the 100mm ones didnt come in till sometime in the late 80s on the 1.8 carb/injection models

    edit: oh and sometimes the diffo part numbers for CVs is only due to the type of boot used. 4 stud MK3s use the same CV as the equivalent MK2 item, just the boot in the kit differs. unfortunately ETKA doesn't actually list the bare CV part numbers anymore, this would be a highly useful bit of information
     
  9. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    If there were 020 boxes with 100mm flanges which weren't 250mm apart, maybe there's scope - but as far as we know, they don't exist.

    Trying to think of the best way of chasing the part number data through.
     
  10. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Admin

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    I did look in the rocco section att zee 100mm diffs & flanges, but all party numbers the same as mk2. the 16v rocco used a 2y box same as the MK2!
     
  11. danster Forum Addict

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    I suspect ETKA saying the mk2 scirocco uses the same shaft as a mk2 golf is an error. I have stripped far too many motors over the years and have never come across this. My mates run a mk2 golf shaft on their mk1 / scirocco stock cars along with extending the wishbone to give it bit more camber for going round the ovals as it allows the wheel to be further out without the cv popping
    .
    The mk1 golf & mk2 scirocco shafts change too as not all carb versions had 90mm inner cvs. Late 1800 carb models have 100mm inner cvs.
    There may be different part nos for the 100mm inner cv but by all accounts they are interchangeable.

    That aside the shaft lengths are really what is important on this thread with regard to widetracking and the cv inner and outer can be selected to suit.
     
  12. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    So is the info only in the bit of ETKA/ETOS relating to the Scirocco 16V?

    If it is, it feels like an error, if it doesn't sit in mainstream Scirocco sections.
     
  13. danster Forum Addict

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    Good point there but that stuff is so old and rare. The early mk1 gti golf gearboxes did not have the big springs (cheap lsd!) and the green seal sleeves as you mention.
     
  14. danster Forum Addict

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    Chris, looking at the table now, it could be updated when you get a chance to list a few other measurements as the mk2 section does not take 90 or 100mm cvs into account.

    EG

    Golf Mk1 & Scirocco Mk1 & 2 - 020box
    -90mm
    -100mm

    Golf Mk2 -020box
    -90mm
    -100mm

    Golf Mk3 -020box
    -90mm
    -100mm

    Everyone of the above shafts are a different length and there are more if the small gearbox 084 4 speed / 085 5 speed are taken into consideration.
     
  15. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    I thought the 90mm CVs were history, post Mk1 chassis/derivatives?

    If not, I'll add all of the above in.

    Agree on the 084/085 Mk1 shafts :thumbup:
     
  16. danster Forum Addict

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    The 90mm inner cvs were fitted in some scirroco mk2s till quite late so are obtainable in scrappys etc.

    084, 085 and any 90mm inner cv shafts from mk1-3 can be used with slight mods to run 100mm cvs.;)
     
  17. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    Are 084/085 = 90mm

    But all big block 020 Mk3 Golfs are 100mm?

    If that's it, I'll revise the table to suit.
     
  18. danster Forum Addict

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    All 084 / 085 are 90mm iirc, but they are different between the output flanges of the gearbox compared to the 020 90mm flange measurements. ie smaller then the 234mm and as such mean yet more shafts! VW seemed to manage to keep one of the shafts the same as the 90mm shafts on the 020 box equipped cars. The os one that is, so in reality there is just one extra shaft (a ns one) that is longer. 3 shafts mk1,2&3 NS
    Phew!

    EDIT not 100% sure about all mk3 020s being 100mm though.
     
  19. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    Yes, understand entirely - cut my teeth on 084s.

    Did the Mk3 ever run the 085 on 1.4 models? IIRC, some peculiar 020 derivative appeared on 1.6 small block-derived Mk4s, but I can't pick out when it emerged.

    I have a spare 084 so I can check flange-to-flange face distances :thumbup:

    Updated for Mk1 & 2 084/5 possibilities so far:

     
  20. danster Forum Addict

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    Yes mk3 1.4 ABD engine (early) used 085 box then went to that weird hybrid box which was like an 020 but went onto the small block bellhousing. I presume that is just the same as the normal 020 though across the flanges.
    Mk4 1.6 got the legendary 02K which is an 020 with hydraulic clutch and had an amazing ability to fall apart. I presume that is just the same as the normal 020 though across the flanges too.
    I am off for a beer now! Double phew!
     

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