Scruffy red MK2 Golf Road Rally car

Discussion in 'Members Gallery' started by TonyB, Jan 1, 2014.

  1. Savagesam

    Savagesam Moderator Staff Member Moderator

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    304mm under 15’s :O

    they’re lovely wheels.
     
  2. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Thanks Sam, they looked to be up to the job, were the right price and have good clearance for calipers etc.
     
    Last edited: May 9, 2022
  3. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    So the next phase was to upgrade the 204bhp engine as it was just too wishy washy and had no real grunt as I mentioned before. Jason at JMR was tasked with porting the head properly and I sent one down and a box of bits to attach. Whilst he doesn't like to use customer supplied parts (for various reasons) Jason and I go back a way and he knows I'm not daft, so generally supply something usable that will do the job, just not always quite as he would like it :lol:

    Whilst on paper it looks like nothing really changed there were a whole host of small but important changes to the spec.

    The headline changes were ported head, supertech waisted valves +0.5mm inlets and std exhaust, FCP solid lifters, Newman full race cams, Newman springs plus some odds and sods.

    Jason and I discussed the spec. and what he wanted from the bottom end, timings and details of the ancillaries etc, so I modified the bottom end to suit the head and cam set uas requested, then fine tuned the other bits to suit, Inlet manifolds etc. I had done a bit of work on injectors and some other areas of the engine and components I wanted to change, so sorted that out as well. IMG_20190915_170113_resized_20210618_015559726.jpg IMG_20190915_170123_resized_20210618_015559430.jpg IMG_20190929_165214_resized_20210618_015558711.jpg IMG_20190929_180952_resized_20210618_015558090.jpg IMG_20191115_172950_resized_20210618_015342655.jpg IMG_20191123_172313_resized_20210618_015341949.jpg IMG_20191123_172441_resized_20210618_015341221.jpg
     
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  4. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    So in addition to the basic engine, all the ancillaries were reviewed and I decided to move away from the SBD injectors I had been using as these are rated at 230bhp. They were maxed out on my 8v engine that I pinched them from, which was making around 234bhp at the time, so that made sense. They were well within limits on the phase one version of this engine, but the new one would need more headroom on flow. I addition I heard there could be an issue with positioning of the injectors with this particular manifold that could hamper power, so I spent some time chatting to Simon at ASNU (who I had met when I was invited as a Demo car at one of Forge Motorsport days at Coombe) who is a very well informed chap when it comes to race car fueling, and a mine of information having worked at all levels of motorsport induction up to F1, to make sure we got all the power available.

    We settled on a custom built wide fan multi hole injector with decent atomisation, more than enough flow head room for a N/A motor, what ever tune, and a wide enough fan to get good converge on the full port.

    Original SBD 3 hole injector. IMG_20191006_150038_resized_20210623_084821718.jpg
     
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  5. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    New ASNU injectors. They needed some spacers and the fuel rails machining down, as I didn't want to have loads of spacers or overly large ones, as that gave me more clearance at the airbox end on the throttle bodies, that was a bit tight before. IMG_20200215_123042_resized_20210623_085042299.jpg IMG_20200216_181134_resized_20210623_085227177.jpg
     
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  6. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    So once all the injector assembly was complete, the throttle bodies were matched to the manifold, the manifold to the head and the whole lot marked for alignment and bolted up. I don't use gaskets generally as it messes the joints up [flow], just lap the two parts together. The jenvey's has O rings so they were fine (the Works STW head I have has o rings as well....much better). Not easy to take pics down the manifold/port, and it looks rough and there is some black marker on the port still where I was marking inaccuracies to blend, but the picture is deceptive, its just the slightly rough finish you want for flow, none of that polishing nonsense here!

    And a pic of the final install. The filter is a foam affair, but shrouded from the heat and with a direct feed from the front. Probably work better if I made a decent airbox and had an indirect air feed, as I think the direct feed probably messes up the flow a little, but it works ok. IMG_20190929_165128_resized_20210618_015559091.jpg IMG_20200628_164341_resized_20210623_085528216.jpg
     
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  7. Tristan

    Tristan Paid Member Paid Member

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    Interesting stuff re the injectors, and that there's someone who can advise about them!
     
  8. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Yes Simon is an interesting guy, he's an engineer so only interested in the facts though lol. Worked in FI during the first Turbo era, touring cars and has experience of VW Kitcar engines etc, so a wealth of knowledge.....but not easy to get hold of as he is in demand but knows what he is on about to be fair.

    The engine performed well, but I made a lot of small changes, so difficult to tell how much they helped, but the engine is very strong midrange so good fueling must have a hand in that I would assume.
     
  9. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Short video form the Recent Llandow sprint we attended.

     
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  10. Tristan

    Tristan Paid Member Paid Member

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    Sounds really crisp. Impressive wet braking too!
     
  11. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Yeah she's quick to be fair was 3rd in a class of 10, 0.5 secs off the win, not bad for my first drive for 3 years and first run in with this engine/box & suspension set up.

    It's an odd class as it was South West regs. I was in the 1.8 to 2.6 normally aspirated class (at 2.0 ltr), so all the turbos in the 1.4 to 1.8 ltrs move up a class and ned up in that class. So out with new Fiesta ST220 1.6 turbo's, super charged Mini Copper S's and an S3 A3 plus some other turbos.

    Was fastest in the class by a mile in the wet (in the top 20 out of 100+ cars inc. single seater, 'Caterfields' and national runners [:D] ), but I like the wet at Llandow. Took a little while to dial in my brain to the G's you can carry round the corners as it dried and a bit cautious on the bend before the top straight where I trashed Tatty Golf last time I was there!

    Never did quite get that corner out of my mind, but got the others dialed in reasonably well and started enjoying the G force the sticky tyres and chassis gave, one more run and I think I could have won the class. I was taking 2.5 seconds off my time every run, where as the others had peaked and were just taking tenths off. That's the only problem with Hill climbs and sprints, you get 4 runs and have to make the last one count, 100% perfect and on the pace.

    I'm out at Pembrey on the 14th August to have another go. Pembrey is tricky as you have to carry good corner speed and being a proper circuit there is a lot of track to pick from for the right line. Proper track knowledge is critical for a fast time. Think the car might run out of revs down the back straight. She's geared for 115mph @ 8500rpm, so touch and go. The tell tale on the rev counter says I was using 8600rpm at Llandow at times.

    She was hitting the limiter here and there as she gets up there quite quick, keeps pulling, so you don't get much warning, except for the flashing lights.....but I'm not sure where the shift lights are set. Probably to suit the 8V, which was 8500 rpm, so might re set the lights at 8800rpm and the hard cut the same (don't use the soft cut as you can't really feel it and it just stops you accelerating). Will give me around 120mph down the back straight at Pembrey, which should be ok. Piston speeds a bit high at 8800rpm, but she'll be ok for 6>8 seconds or so. Its build strong so the motor will take it.
     
  12. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    One thing i found in the car was that she rode the curbs very well. You have to take a lot of curb at Llandow to go fast in a tin top. the single seaters can just drive round the curbs and go quick, they make it up on the straights, with their low weight and drag, plus aero to help around the twisty bits.

    I changed the front suspension quite a bit recently, but the big change was to run some Vibratech rear wishbone bushes as opposed to the Poly Red ones in there before. Not sure what make the poly ones were, but poly in the rear bushes never seemed like a good idea to me. ideally I'd go rose joints, but the regulations in my class ban that, so poly is the normal choice as they are cheap. But I've noticed the suspension movement is very limited with Poly, so had decided a long time ago to invest in the Vibratech rear bushes, which seemed to provide the best compromise of movement and rigidity in my mind, with some poly Black race bushes at the front as they just need to pivot.

    At first I Thought the car was a bit soft, but I'm running something like 450lbs/in on the front with GRP A Bilstein inserts, so shouldn't be far off......but realised it was just the suspension was being allowed to work.....and looking at a few pics it seems to be riding reasonably flat through some of the tight and twisty areas, and was certainly handling as good as it ever has, but was just absorbing the curbs without upsetting the car at all.

    I'll do an update ion the current set up when I get a chance, but here is a pic I found of the car on line.

    FB_IMG_1626627538213.jpg
     
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  13. Tristan

    Tristan Paid Member Paid Member

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    That's interesting about the bushes.
     
  14. HPR

    HPR Administrator Admin

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    Maybe set the the lights say @ 8400 - 8500 , a pinch before the intended shiftpoint and set the soft limiter a pinch higher , say @ 8600 > a few hundred before the hard cut @ 8800 ..... imo its better than hit he hard limiter which cut the engine out for a moment and it will cost more time ..
     
    Last edited: Jul 19, 2021
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  15. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Few pics of the modified front wishbones. Got hold of a pair of OEM wishbones ( they all seem to come with bushes etc these days), modified them and strengthened them as required. I added a tube to the central hole and then made top and bottom plates. If you look it closely when you join up [weld] the dots it essentially creates a tubular wishbone shape from a std wishbone, adding strength in all the right places without all the added weight of a solid plate. You only need the added stiffness where it matters. As above, used poly Black bushes on the pivots, but Vibratech for the rear bush as poly just doesn't work in that situation IMHO. Results in a nice supple ride but still very tight, and allows the full range of suspension movement for the curbs and holes. Quite happy with them.

    The geometry change was to calm down the torque steer induced by 250+bhp. I've carried out a lot of subtle mods to dial that out over the last few months. It had become a little violent in the lower gears. Now you only notice it on the road, and its quite controllable. When your on it on track its not noticeable now, you have far more to worry about and no on coming traffic to get dragged in to!


    IMG_20210417_122729_resized_20210524_090031907.jpg IMG_20210417_170123_resized_20210524_090032852.jpg IMG_20210417_181721_resized_20210524_090033191.jpg IMG_20210501_181031_1_resized_20210524_090316855.jpg IMG_20210503_181408_resized_20210524_090318053.jpg IMG_20210509_161610_resized_20210524_090521919.jpg
     
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  16. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Yes, I guess having the soft cut close to the ultimate hard cut in this situation, where you are using it for top speed on a straight rather than on a twisty hill climb, could be a better way.

    On a twisty tight event I find the soft cut a pain, as your don't always realise you are in to it as you are busy, so you can sit in the soft cut for a while, where you really should have shifted.
     
  17. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Engine update, nothing new inside, just a mapping session.

    The last map we had was quite vicious mid-range and very fluffy low down. Last time out at Llandow it took the first 4 or five corners to get her to rev out clean as the plugs were fouling sitting waiting and on part throttle…………….so on to 2022.

    Vince Mosley of Mosley’s Rolling Road picked her up with 20lts (so I thought!) of fresh Shell V Power in her tank to do some work on the mapping.

    Got a call late in the day she had run out of petrol! Turns out a leak between the pump and housing I quickly fixed last year (or didn’t) had failed, so a quick run to Tesco’s (needs must!) for 20trs of their finest fuel and all was well. The mapping was finished the next day.

    The reality is that this MBE ECU came out of my 224bhp 8v, the map was then adjusted for the initial temporary 204bhp 16v and subsequently adjusted for the last 253bhp version, so we had ended up with a bit of a mixed bag.

    Vince and Ian basically went back to scratch and built a new map, concentrating on the low and mid-range areas, as top end was ‘more than enough’…in Vince’s words lol.

    The map below shows the torque peaks at 5000rpm (147lbs/ft) and holds on well right through to 8600rpm. You need to read the black lines up to where the red section takes over. The top end was tidied up last and checked.

    Vince tells me the dip at 8k shouldn’t be there, was playing with timing apparently, it should be a straight line to the 8300rpm plot.

    Power is still on the rise at 8600 rpm, but the piston speed is too high at that stage really, so the runs were terminated there, and must be at its limit as its still only on +0.5mm in and std ex valves sizes and 296 cams, so the JMR head is really flowing well, helped by 48mm Jenveys and a nice 4/2/1 2.75" system....all proper put together of course ;).

    Peak power at 8584rpm was 212.4bhp at the wheels, so approx. 247bhp at the crank. Slightly down on the 253bhp we had before, but that was on V Power not Tesco’s finest and top end power wasn't on the agenda this time.

    Limiter is set at 8700rpm to give a bit head room, but last time out it was running straight in to the limiter with no warning, Vince did comment it feels very unstressed on the roller at peak RPM, that's why its so easy to hit the limiter.

    I’m told when tested she pulls clean from 2k has plenty of mid-range and is really quick once spinning….and sounds epic as well.

    I’ve not driven this version of the engine yet as I have few things to sort before I have a spin…..but we are out at Epynt Hillclimb for a run weekend 18th & 19th June, so she’ll be out before then.

    IMG_20220510_133439_resized_20220510_015921783.jpg
     
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  18. Tristan

    Tristan Paid Member Paid Member

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  19. daNpy Forum Member

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    I understand Tony is racing, which means this could not be allowed? :)

    Furthermore, interestering thread. Dyno numbers look really good. Also the re-build and reinforced track arms are nicely made. Will follow this thread!
     
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  20. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Yes, not allowed to use fuel additives, pump fuel. However if you race down the South West and the tin top guys spill fuel on the grass you have never seen a plant die so fast :lol:. Goodness knows what they use, but I think its brewed in vats in barns down there!
     

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