Finally refueling a very long KR to ABF CIS conversion

Discussion in 'Corrado' started by watercooled, Apr 7, 2021.

  1. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Some of these questions are related to the 16V engine section but most related to my engine swap so hope that's ok ?
    Is it best to use the ABF downpipe I have ?
    temp sensors on the left of the cyl/head appear different connections from kr to abf ? I know why but can they be swapped for my conversion to CIS wiring ?
    the engine for the swap has low kms but been sitting for a long time so was thinkin reseal and headgasket ?
    There will be more questions as I move on and the kr is around 40% out of the car,donor motor in storage but hopefully here next week ,cheers
     
  2. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,321
    Location:
    Bracknell
    if you're keeping it on kjet you can keep the existing exhaust, swap over all the bits and bobs that differ over from the old KR engine so sensors in side of the head, WUR things like that.if you have the abf downpipe keep it in stock though, as if you ever want to go abf managment or use a lambda you coudl fit that with a mk3 decat pipe to get you a lambda boss.

    note if you're using the kjet inlet you need the KR/9a front coolant flange, and this means you cant use the ABF alternator setup with tensioner wheel as it hits the spring pack. you can get the alternator and bracket from earlier 8v engine with the big spring rather than tensioner wheel that'll swap over with existing pas setup

    new seals all round worth doing but head gasket will be fine unless you know its been sat with water in it, and if thats the case the block will probably want rebuilding anyway. if its been sat in a dry corner just chuck it in
     
  3. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Thanks for the prompt reply,got you on the coolant flange , one on the abf was different,seem to remember it was a plastic one,I really dislike plastic coolant parts besides.
    I don't have the ABF altenator set so will use the bits off the KR ,altenator was fully rebuilt before I bought the car.
    Engine has been outside for a period but well covered so crossing my fingers here,checked it yesterday and its seems ok,cheers.
     
  4. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,321
    Location:
    Bracknell
    if all the ports look clean front and back you're probably fine
     
  5. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Few more questions and hopefully answers will be easy as not that schooled up on 16V stuff....
    Kr motor ? is there a harmonic balancer on the the crank pulley with early motors ?,I haven't taken it off yet.
    Can't use ABF pulleys as most have been "robbed" by my so called mate who sold ready to swap motor !!!!!!.
    Weird waterpump pulley with idler ,some sideways play ,seems it is ok bearing wise and spins without noise ,is that going to be ok ? .
     
  6. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,321
    Location:
    Bracknell
    they do have rubber damped crank pulley yep
     
  7. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Thanks John ,thought it would be,just hope the rubber isn't all cracked up,when these go bad they can slip the outer and the timing mark won't line up,had this with one on my Mk3,had to bin that one.
     
  8. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,321
    Location:
    Bracknell
    yep seen the same on a mk3 I worked on, was a bit confusing at first :lol:
     
  9. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Got crank pulley off and found the damper in great condition,however the idler pulley on the waterpump is buggered....what to do,parts like this are pretty hard to find in my country,KR motors are pretty rare.
    What is the purpose of this part,I fail to understand why it is needed and can't get my head around it ??.
    I have some other normal pulleys but appears the offsets might be wrong,my other option maybe to weld it solid.
     
  10. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,321
    Location:
    Bracknell
    its used becasue the 2 belts spin at slightly different speeds, so you have a solid pulley which drives the waterpump and the free pulley allows the other belt to spin at a different speed

    you can convert to the late MK2 or Corrado setup which goes back to a conventional belt setup with 1 belt for waterpump and another belt just for pas, though this may not be any easier to get. alternatively if you can find one the ABF engine crank pulley could be used to convert it to run mk3 alternator setup
     
  11. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Thanks John ,makes sense now so got you on that one cheers,can't use it anymore but have mk3 90amp altenator and ABF crank pulley,however don't have the mount/tensioner, should be able to find one of those.
    Cheers.
     
  12. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,321
    Location:
    Bracknell
    only thing is if its the later type alt which goes on bracket with tensioner pulley, the KR/9a front coolant flange hits the spring pack (have to fit to ABF if staying kjet). so you need the early 8v alt+bracket with the big spring under the alternator
     
  13. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Still hunting for altenator mounting plate/tensioner and ribbed waterpump pulley,have the plastic coolant flange and on to some leads ,the mk3's were imported here in fairly decent numbers but plain jane models have very low value many not still on the road now and scrapped long ago.
    John in answer to your question about possible water damage from storage,checked the ports and they were a bit crusty but cleaned up,found valves had light rust marks that cleaned off and none of them leaking @ TDC.
    Engine turned over easily with plugs out,think I dodged a bullet here.....happy camper as I was a little worried.
     
  14. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Wondering if a alternator bracket from a 8V 2.0 AGG will fit as I have found one on an auction site,can't seem to find part numbers so need to ask if it will work ?
    The system on the AGG is crank pulley 6 rib from crank to tensioner and then alternator,rest is driven via vee belt off outer crank pulley...correct ?
    My 90amp alternator came off a 92 mk3 golf and pretty sure it will work and besides is an upgrade from the small KR 65amp unit.
     
  15. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,321
    Location:
    Bracknell
    as long as its early non-ac type without tensioner wheel you're fine, the problem with the tensioner wheel ones is the KR flange hits up against them.

    apart from that any type 1.8-2.0 8v or 16v setup will fit any 1.8-2.0 16v engine (petrol models) only specific thing is the crank pulley which you match asd the 8v timing belt sprocket is thinner than the 16v one. you have 3 versions of alternator bracket the early non-ac one which uses a big spring under the alternator to set tension, the alternator is also specific for this bracket. then 2 versions of the tensioner bracket one with mount points for the a/c compressor and one without. the alternator is same fitment for both of these, but the alternator belts are different thicknesses as the ac version of the bracket moves the alternator up and out a bit

    But yeah, TLDR: use the early non-ac spring loaded alternator bracket, like this:
    028903143AD.jpg

    and alternator needs to be this type to match:
    g3earlyalt.jpg
     
  16. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Thanks again ,never seen that spring tensioner before,I guess its because all the mk2's I have worked on or have owned had A/C because most or all have been Japanese import cars,nowever my 87 GTI didn't have this setup and that was a UK import so a little confused.
    I have the plastic offset water pipe so no issues there with the mk3 type bracket tensioner
    I do have a spare RV mk2 1.8 longblock so I will check the bracket on that as maybe I could go back to vee belt drive altenator to make things easier.
    Update,checked the 8v engine and the bracket appears to be the same offset as the KR 1.8 one so no use really,I do have the pulleys off this motor so I can maybe mix and match but again its about sizes and offset....what a PITA.
     
  17. rubjonny

    rubjonny Administrator Staff Member Admin

    Joined:
    Oct 31, 2003
    Likes Received:
    3,321
    Location:
    Bracknell
    mk2 didnt have this, its early non-ac mk3 :)

    the problem is you need to use a mk2/corrado 16v front flange with a kjet inlet manifold, the abf one wont fit. and since the kr one is pointing over to the alternator side it hits the tensioner bracket. offer it all up though may get away with it
     
  18. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Oh ok ,my VR6 and two 8v mk3's all had A/C so that would explain why I've never seen that bracket ,anyway moving on I have decided to go back to the vee belt system,took the waterpump pulley off the 89 8V 1.8 ( part number 027 121 031 ) and found it was the same size as the KR crank pulley.
    Swapped back to vee pulleys and found the alignment was spot on between them,however the altenator alignment is out a bit ,I believe this has been like this for some time judging by the heavy side wear on this belt,I have a way to fix this so not too worried.
    As per pic this is what I will end up with,thanks John for the image ,yes I did steal it but hope you don't mind ?
     

    Attached Files:

  19. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Cut some off the bracket inwards to block and re spaced alternator, after measuring carefully found the drive pulley was 6mm out of line,went over the service history and the alternator has been replaced and the second one rebuilt !!!!,I think the replacement one had wrong drive pulley offset....can't think of another reason.
    Need to get off my ass with the ABF and get the old 1.8 out ,cheers.
     
  20. watercooled Forum Member

    Joined:
    Aug 19, 2012
    Likes Received:
    105
    Location:
    Nelson,New Zealand
    Reasonable progress between doing other non VW chores,ABF is starting to look more than just a longblock now with most parts swapped over.
    Went to swap over oil filter mount and found the KR one won't fit the ABF block ,hunted around and found one of an mk3 that was correct and had a better oil cooler as the one off the KR was corroded on the coolant side to pipe.
    Have fitted the ABF exhaust manifold as think its better to use that as it came with the motor,the KR one will stay on that motor which would be a good core unit for someone what to fit it to an mk2 on carbs or what ever.
    Fitted new crank seal as when moving the engine it leaked a fair amount of oil when tilted too far over,found out why as the seal carrier had been damaged by some muppet and one of the dowels was damaged and the seal wasn't running concentric to the crank so crank was very grooved out in one spot, I repaired this problem and my replacement seal is now running clear of the damaged area as the lip offset was different.
    Will report on further progress,cheers .
     

Share This Page

  1. This site uses cookies to help personalise content, tailor your experience and to keep you logged in if you register.
    By continuing to use this site, you are consenting to our use of cookies.
    Dismiss Notice