we often find our way back here.... very true / real scenario - I'm actually looking for an 8V ibiza presently as a run about / trackday hack, going to go back to more simple times
Hi Chris, get yourself booked up for Cadwell July 31st and have a deadline to work to!! - My trouble being, the mk2 is the only car I have so it HAS to be bearable on road (hence fully carpeted/soundproofed still and not too high spring rates) but now I'm doing more track days then ever before, bits have to be up to that kind of use too. All good fun. As Rob has shown with the pickle, the more you do to the car for the track the more road unfriendly the car becomes and it comes to a point where you have to (sensibly) trailer the thing about.
Pretty much, but then I think if you've installed MS in the first place you're probably that type of person anyway That said i've not actually touched my MS at all since xmas now, partly due to a lack of spare time but also because it doesn't need it, it goes fine. The g/f was even using it as a daily driver over most of the winter (she didn't much like trying to start it in the morning at sub-zero temps with no ISV, but it held up ). I've still got a few ideas I want to get around to trying though, all is not done yet. Just don't hold your breath, I don't work at the fastest pace
The type who also tries different cams, tyres, ARB's, Brake pads, suspension settings,different engines and can't really leave their car alone, Sound familiar gary............. You know it makes sense both from a performance and price point of view and doesn't have to take up too much time, you don't need to write your own code as keith has done. Mine warms up and idles really well on the basic mk1 aux air valve, i have just followed the basics in the manual and used software that is already tested and proven. You can have a copy of all my settings if your worried about that side of it. I honestly think you would enjoy it.
Anybody`s free to try my code (latest based on extra 029L), may be better suited to cammed 16v`s as mine was a real ***** to get idleing right on MS, I`ve used the KR idle valve so settings shouldn`t be too far off. It`s near factory for me, cold and hot. Even if you run ITB`s the Ignition timing table should help get a good hot idle. So that`s 200 or less for an ecu and 500 for Badger 5 ITB`s .
SteveR had a quote on a pdf file from Bill last year and the 45mm DTH throttle bodies,fuel rails,air horns and throttle mech came to 742 inc Vat. I gather they're Bosch fitment injectors correct? , so loads of choices there to use. Few sensors, filter socks,FPR and fittings etc etc jobs a good 'un..
I got a set of 420cc injectors from G-Werks, they also do a 30lb set for 120. I`ve got some s/h injectors but you don`t want to risk it really. If you do got the MS/ITB route I`d seriously consider fitting it all to your current engine, get it running right, have a go at tuning it and then go to the new engine. MS instal should be a walk in the park for you Gary, keep the k-jet pumps and run an adaptor from the solid fuel lines in the `bay (or get custom lines like martyn). You could try spark only to start with then upgrade to ITB`s later? I`d never go back from Standalone EFI now..
Keith whole point of the new block is that the 9A big ends are growling and have been for a few months now. So the block is a priority...
Sticking throttle plates are down to user setup problem.... when synching them up (badly) and resting them on the throttle stop as closed, which is a tight fit (obviously for closed throttle), so the main idle adjust should tip the throttle plates slightly open and smooth action is idle balance via balance bleeds trims em up. Nothing wrong with the throttle bodies, but people can and do cock them up when fidling with them. Once you have done it a few times its easy peasy. You cant compare the VW 16v and the XE motor.... and blame t'bodies for an avg spec VW engine not matching an XE.... VW motor is simply not as good a place to start as an XE no matter what injection/induction system is on it. Want power from a VW valver then think big cams and high CR. Bolt on's onto std CR and avg cams is luke warm performance nudging the 200bhp level. XE motor with same mods will be more. (better engine design to begin with, especially the cylinder head design) - sad but true.
Obviously with the new block the engine will (well I bloody hope so) want to rev and the higher CR will help the torque. I've always wanted a car that sounds like a mk2 Escort RS1800 BDA rally car, so ITBs will just have to be fitted to it at some point. Are the prices above still valid at the mo Bill? Feck, I'm talking myself into it.. aghhhh!!!
I suppose you are at a bit of a crossroads Gary...Do I, Dont I??? K-Jet will be towards its limit fuelling your new engine. I had issues with the throttle spindles/pot on B6. This was down to how they were initially set up & mapped @ Stealth. Now sorted thanks to Mr Greenald.... Going to ITBs running a stock CR doesnt yield massively impressive power gains IMHO, though the driving "experience" is transformed. Steve Greenald was of exactly the same opinion as Bill. The 16v VW motor is no match for XE's, Zetecs or even the 1800 K-series for that matter, thus the power/torque figures do lack a little in comparison. Sad fact of life Having said that, my power output is very healthy for the spec & a 16v VW (says Mr G) & no doubt could be worked on with more C.R & slightly hotter cams. BIG power such as that of RobT's Ibiza is only really going to come from Big Revs (8000+) , & thus, an expensive build. You are then moving away from a daily use kind of car, with all the power concentrated at the top end. Interesting that the 268/276 cam combo on B6 provides peak power at 7300 & holds fully to 7600. Previous Stealth map gave peak at 6800...shows what difference mapping makes. Pulls perfectly & strongly from idle too Going any further than this 200ish BHP area is going to require binning the rod box too...I have already suffered clutch/flywheel issues as you know... I really feel that my car is now at that ultimate mk2 16v road/track combination power wise. Any more power would start breaking transmission stuff (even) more regularly, & further developments would compromise the road-friendliness More track pace will come from chassis tweaks.....25/28 ARB set up, R888s etc...& possibly the 8v F.D. Saying that im quite happy with how it goes...even if somewhat "lukewarm" compared to the BadgerWagen
Did the Greenald map help the economy at all Chris (gay question I know but it is a factor for road use)
LOL.. but then again I do carry around my own flame thrower to warm things up these days masquerading as an exhaust tailpipe.. more than peak figures on t'bodies and mappable management, thinking area under the curve and throttle response. I'm sure Gary will succumb to the dark side one day. (will sure have a nice motor to stick em on)
My motor is not a top end power motor, its built for hillclimbing and thus loads of midrange - >150ftlb from 4000-7500 peaking at 170ftlb from 5000-6250. If I wanted more top end I could get another 15-20hp from going bigger on the TB's and changing the mapping but for hillclimbing I'm not sure this would be of use to me - maybe if I had a big close ratio dog or sequential box. Even though the engine will go to 8750rpm, I dont routinely use this although what it does give you is big over-rev capacity to hold a single gear between 'obstacles' and not have to change up a gear then down again, potentially upsetting the car in the process = slower - when you can pull hard from 4K to 8.75K 2nd gear is very useful on a hillclimb / sprint. This year I have increased the diameter and width of the front (Gary ) tyres from 21.5 - 23.3 inch as I reckon the car will pull em as done some more mods recently to get even more torque (ignition and exhaust mods) - this will give even more breath of speed in a single gear and hopefully not spin-up the tyres as much as it used to. Going to experiment soon with some different injectors also as things have moved on a bit since cossie blues, better spray patterns, multi pintle injectors etc etc - all good for mid range I would like to stick some DTH 48 or 50's on it, or even 8 injector with the second set in the airhorns, but then I suspect I will have to shell out 4-5K on a close ratio 02A dogbox (not a quaife) to go with them to use the narrower power band - and it would be more like 8K for a sequantial.....not going to happen Cheers Rob
< puts fingers in ears.. > lalalalalalaaa I'm not listening to all this throttle body chat llaalalalalalala[:^(] I thought you made a coffee table from the wheels Dr? That's it, you get some 48s and sell me your 45s!!
