Electric power steering in the mk2

half way down, using a corsa C column
http://forums.vwvortex.com/showthread.php?3277830-Golf-mk2-16vT-Mid-Engine-RWD-Race-car-build/page84

 

The citroen/peugeot electric pump is used quite a bit. Here's a link about using a Saxo PAS pump on Passion Ford. More than likely the way I'll go, although it is heavier than going the corsa EPAS route. That said, the pump can be put on the passenger side and keep weight away from the drivers side (good for us RHD'ers!)

I have a Mk5 daily and the steering feel on that is horrible. As good as no feedback, and not something I'd bother retro fitting despite it looking to be a straight forward and compact option (just a bit of effort). I haven't knowingly driven a car with the corsa EPAS setup with a control module, so won't comment on the feel, but I'm definitely intrigued with it on a low assistance. I've heard it does somewhat kill feedback also though

 

Interesting thoughts.

My need a special PAS pump arrangement is the same as ScruffyDubber's, i.e. it's a 16V G60 engine. But, in addition I'm planning to use an A/C setup from a Rallye, which places the compressor quite far down so that the charger U-bend can be used together with the full-size FMIC, rather than the little top-mount intercooler that my G60 Syncro has as standard (it came with A/C). Now the Rallye A/C kit I have places the PAS pump at the back of the block with an arrangement of rather shonky brackets. So I'd quite like to eliminate that with an electric pump.

Gareth / Scruffydubber and I are hopefully going to try his Saxo pump in one of our MK2s shortly.

 

Bringing this thread back from the dead..........did this ever get resolved and are the Saxo pumps the weapon of choice?

 

Anyone?

 

Seem to remember mrhillclimb might have one in his

 

Cheers.....be interested to see what was involved and how effective it is

 

Converted my mk1 race car to corsa b full electric setup, with proper speed sensing, not a lousy pot. Seems to work well. Next up is the same conversion on my mk2 rally car, in the usual long line of jobs to do
Jon
Also have a spare 106GTI electric hydraulic pump setup from my 106 race car build. If anybody wants to buy it its collection only

 

Jon, on the corsa setup, did you use the General Motors orange relay that converts old type ABS sensor pulses into a 0-5V signal?

My installation could require an electric pump, due to the OEM aspiration pipework routing on the 2.0TDi engine, that would be fouled by a belt-driven power steering pump setup.

My original Mk2 Golf steering column is already modified to accommodate Mk5 Golf top end squab and column stalks / ignition switch.......so might be sticky to add an electric column.

I presume the 106 pump is similar to the Pug one and runs continuously?
Would you have any pics of the parts you've got for sale please?

 

Yes, on the relay.
Email me with an email add and I will take some, if I get time
Jon

 

NigeP has used a pug 106 electric pump on his mk2 track car with success, 106 is same as saxo.
I am also interested in this...

i have a 2001 fiat punto as my cheap runaround and i am impressed with the steering on it, a lot of people say it lacks feel, but i disagree.
it may be due to the fact that i am running 195/50/15 toyo proxes t1r's on it, but even with the city button pressed all the time at 60mph+ throwing it around bendy A-roads you can always feel the tight spot where the grip is and what the car is doing.

When i first got the punto it was running steel wheels with tall skinny budget tyres, which basically ruins the feel of any car IMO.
A large part of steering feel is down to tyre size and grip.

i do not believe that steering needs to be heavy to enable spirited or hard driving, in fact i had a small incident in my old NON-PAS mk2 where i had to swerve mid corner and it snatched back and i couldn't catch it.

I am very tempted to put a fiat punto electric column in my mk2.

 

Yeah, as already said, I use one and have NO issues with it. A good setup imo.

 

Just thought id let people know, Me and a friend used the corsa stuff to do the same conversion in a mk2f polo G40. Its well hidden and works well. Wasnt really difficult to do either. Only problem we had was the pump hitting the battery tray in the polo. We nocked the bulkhead in a little with a hammer. Following year we cut the bulkhead out and done it properly. Would never tell its non oem now. Except from the GM badge ofcourse.

 

I have a 106/Saxo electric pump in my Golf Mk 2 rally car - but I'm not really digging it - at least not with the exact components that are in my car.
It simply lacks assist for the tight curves - it is too heavy now.

A bit of background:
I came from the stock mechanical pump, and I feel that the assist is simply lacking too much. It has gone down.

I do have a 1.5:1 steering quickener installed on the column, and that obviously adds to the effort.

Secondly, the electric pump may not be in good working order, so the pressure/flow may be down a bit.

I could measure the flow, but the price of fittings, a gauge and a valve to shut off the flow is more than the price of a new pump.

On the other hand, I fear that the quickener is too much for even a good/new 106/Saxo pump, and am considering an alternative. For instance the pump from a Mercedes A-class or Peugeot 307. They are a bit fiddlier when it comes to the electrics, but not too bad. The 307-one doesn't really require electronics as such - can be wired for full power all the time.

Can any body shed some light on the performance of a 106/Saxo pump in good working order vs. the stock Mk 2?

Just so I can make an educated guess at least .

 

Cheers for the feedback Brian.

Here's what I found on wiring for the 307 pump to work full-time:

"The electric connectivity is slightly more complicated than just connecting to 12V. This is because the pump is quite intelligent beast made by Siemens. It has two connectors: 2 thick pins connector (ground and 12V battery - no brain needed here), other is 9 pins connector which was a bit more of fun. If you just connect +12V battery on 2 pin connector nothing happens, and pump does not start. It surely waits for some signals on another 9 pin connector.
After looking through all info I could find on Peugeot on Google I found next to nothing of something useful how these pins are used. I only found that one red wire (5) goes to ignition switch, other two blue (1) and beige (6) to main control block under steering wheel, then other red (4) goes to ABS, other beige (9) goes to block BSI which is controlling the engine and the last white is diagnostic. No info about how are these signals are behaving. In essence this power steering pump is able to adjust its power in reaction to what steering wheel and ABS do but no info how.
So I've done some experimenting with the pump I found that to start you need to connect and keep connected +12V to ignition (5) and make a short +12V pulse on pump enable (9). Then the pump just runs at full power continuously. It is ok for me as Honda's stock hydraulic power steering also operates at full power when engine is running.
So to make long story short to use Peugeot 307 power steering pump you need to connect it's fat 2-pin connector's pin 1 to 12V battery +, pin 2 to 12V battery - (chassis) and 9 pin connector's pins 5 and 9 tied together car's to ignition key's wire Ign1 which becomes +12V when key is turned to "On" position. This way the pump runs when you need it."

 

I found that exact same thing - I actually believe that the owner of the site is Danish .

But I am still none the wiser as to whether what to expect.

Of you guys with Saxo/106 pump: how is your steering effort compared to the stock pump?

 

I have an 8v with (as far as I know has an original set-up) and it handles lovely. The only car I've ever had that beats it, although only just, is a 1990 mini that I had.

 

Regarding my last comment - I have power steering which makes me the enemy to certain members (possibly with RubJonny??) lol