Wideband O2 Sensor & Controller

Hello All,

I am looking into getting a Wideband Oxygen sensor and controller to hook up to a megasquirt ecu on my 9a equipped mk2 golf.

I have been looking at the options and have basically found two. The first is kit from www.wbo2.com (techedge) and the second is the B&G precision wideband controller. The techedge kit is favourite at the moment.

Q1. As far as i can make out all i need from the WBo2 as far as megasquirt is concerned is a linearised WB output from the WBo2 controller. Is this correct?

Q2. Assuming a yes to Q1 is there any reason to get the more advanced wb02 kits from techedge? ( I am looking at the 2CO kit as it is small and Cheap and I should be able to do all the datalogging i want from megasquirt)

Q3. How much does it cost to import stuff? (tried looking at the customs and excise webpage and it is as clear as mud)

Any other views on wideband oxygen sensor kits/controllers would be appreciated.

Cheers,

Gavin

 

Hello mate


I have the techedge version 2A0 and have been very very VERY pleased with it. The Techedgeservice is superb, the kitarrived within 2-3 weeks. The sensor i got from 1stvwparts in the us,,,,the sensor is cheap there but they charge stupid money for postage as they only use UPS. With the current exchange rate its still a bargain. Luckily i didnt get charged import duty on either the kit or the sensor. Shipping was 50 ausie dollars which is about 20 quid for a complete kit minus sensor.


I dont believe there to be any advantage of using the wideband for the megasquirt lambda input because it treats the wideband linear output as if it was a narrow band but just with a switching point of 2.5volts. You may as well just get yourself a cheap narrowband lambda sensor which you can use for closed loop and just use the wideband to map your fuel and calibrate the correct voltage forthe switching point of the narrow band against the widebands AFR.


Try the techedge, you wont be dissapointed

 

Cheers for the reply.

Looks like the techedge stuff is the way to go then. How much did it cost you all in? 2CO with sensor seemed to be 160 delivered. I have a friend heading to Australia in a weeks time and another heading to the US. Trying to figure out whether it is worth trying to get them to pick the bits up to avoid customs.

I get what you mean about the lambda operation with megasquirt, in closed loop operation it doesn't care about the actual afr and so wideband or narrowband makes no difference. So it would be far better to be running the cheap narrowband once it is set up. Need to check that is the same with the 'extra' firmware. The main reason to wire the wideband through megasquirt would be to have all the datalogging coming from the one source i.e. megasquirt. I think the Megatune3000(?) software can use the logged wideband signal then to set target AFR's? Also using megasquirt to handle the logging means i can get the more basic 2CO unit.

Just when you think you are getting your head round all this you realise that you know nothing and need to re-read all the megasquirt stuff again.

P.S. Does anyone know where there is an ABF manifold/throttle body etc in a scrappies in central/southern scotland?

 

Regarding the wideband kit, whichever one you go for I would definitly advise youto get the LED display as it means you will be able to view your AFR without the need for having a laptop connected. Ive just been on the techedge site and it seems they have loads of different kit options since I got mine. Got the 2A0 kit with 4m cable and display ($535 australian dollars).


Another lambda kit option ive seen is the one www.eiptuning.com sell for about $329 (USDollars) and includes the sensor, I dont know how good this one is but demontweeks have started selling it in their 2005 catalogue for way more money. They say"The meter is capable of storing the AFR as well as RPM, MAP, MAF, TPS or other inputs that you desire, up to five different sensor data, which can be downloaded to a personal computer and viewed in relation to each other" http://www.eiptuning.com/eip/electronics.html


had this one been available when i was looking it would have got serious concideration.

 

That looks like a fairly complete kit at a reasonable price (from US not Demon tweeks @349+VAT). Need to check it out a bit more and recheck what I actually need!

I think the display for megasquirt can show the sensor voltage (or i may have just made that up!). Another thing to check.

 

oh yeah,,,forgot about that megaview

 

I'm waiting for my TechEdge 2A0 kit to arrive, i'll let you know how I get on with it. I know plenty of other Megasquirt users are happy with them. There are also a couple of ready made kits from the US for reasonable money, one is made by Innovate and I can't remember who produced the other I looked at

As for MS not using the wideband, that's not quite true. The 'standard' MS code will treat it as a narrowband, but if you use the Megasquirt'n'Spark-Extra code you get full wideband functionality, with an 8x8 target AFR table for full closed loop control (actually I think you can have 2 AFR tables if you really want).

 

So are you getting the DIY 2AO kit? I was planning to get a prebuilt 2CO. I would be very interested in how you get on if you have bought the kit. It is about 5 years since I did any PCB soldering

 

Yeah, i've gone for the DIY 2A0. As far as I can tell before it arrives, the instructions don't look as clear and 'step-by-step' as the Megasquirt documentation, but the actual assembly looks pretty straightforward anyway. There is a yahoo group for support if you get into any trouble.

Are you going to be constructing your MS yourself? I'd recommend doing it, the familiarity it gives you with the unit will be invaluable later on and it'll save you a wedge of cash at the same time. If you're a bit unsure of your soldering pop down to maplins and pick up a velleman project to practice on first.

 

I was planning to do the megasquirt myself. As you say, getting familiar with the unit is well worth it and part of the learning experience.

I am in two minds about building the 2AO. It would be one less thing to concern myself with if I bought it prebuilt.And I don't really care too much about its internals as long as it works.

If your 2AO doesn't end in tears I might give it a go!

 

Thats great news, there is so much information on the megasquirt site/affiliate sites imnot surprised imissed that.Ive just started building my megasquirt,,,,Glens garage took aaaaages!!!

 

It is getting kind of hard to keep up with the newer developments, things have been moving so fast the documentation can't keep up. Phil and James are now making a concerted effort to slow down development and speed up explanations The documentation on the MS'nS-E sourceforge site is getting better every day.

I found the same with Glen's Garage, it took about 6 weeks to turn up, but was definitely worth the wait. The kit is so well labelled and organised it can't be beaten.

 

My Zeitronix kit arrived today, will post up some results on Sunday hopefully. Looks well built and the display is very nice! Doesn`t datalog without a lappy attcached though..

 

2AO kit arrived today .Only took 26 days to arrive .

Customs charged me 26 quid as well.

The construction instructions are a wee bit less than straight forward but i have all the components on now. Should have it all working by the weekend.

Now if only megasquirt would arrive sometime.......

 

That was a bit slow, mine only took a week or so to come, and I ordered it Boxing Day I know what you mean about the instructions, they seem a bit out of date, and info on the mods for later baords is scattered all over the shop. The only problem I had was a badly flashed processor, I had to reflash the firmware and everything was OK.

Who did you order your MS off? I know a couple of the more popular suppliers are struggling with a huge back order at the mo.

 

I ordered the megasquirt from Glens garage. He said 4 to 6 weeks before dispatch. I am now 5 weeks in. Still got a fair bit of preparation to do to be honest. Need to get the manifold ready for the lambda and a few idle/intake considerations to figure out. Not to mention a zillion odds and sods to find.

Expect the 'squirt to arrive in 3 weeks or so. Should be enough time to sort out the rest hopefully.

 

I got my kit from Glen, was very impressed with it The only problem is they're so good, demand is higher than he can keep up with [:^(]

Let me know if you need any help, your setup sounds like it will be fairly similar to mine as it is now.

 

Cheers for the offer.

My setup only varies from yours in the manifold i think. I am using the ABF manifold which may yet turn out to be a huge pain in the ass. There is no idle bypass so i am going to keep the ISV and hope that it will work on its own to provide idle air. If not I need to rig some kind of idle bypass myself or try the extra's PWM idle control. Also means I will be sharing a coolant sensor.

 

I think you should be OK with that, as far as I could tell the ISV is an independent system to the fuel/ignition so should cope OK. My only concern would be sharing sensors, it never usually works out how you'd hope. If you're using extra to control ignition as well then that would free up a coolant sensor from the old ignition ecu, otherwise you could look at finding a sensor to fit the same thread as the thermotime switch, or a dual output sensor?

 

I think I should be ok to share the ignition coolant sensor. The Ignition ECU seems to give 5v max voltage to the sensor. So if i leave out the megasquirt bias resistor for that sensor and figure out the Ignitions bias resistor value and hence generate a suitable look up table for the sensor it should be peachy.

I will probably hand ignition over to megasquirt at some time but don't want to at the minute.

I think you said you take the tach signal for megasquirt directly from the hall sender? Did you just splice into the wire and feed that straight into megasquirt with no modifications?

And what size/type are the connections on the standard fuel pipes when they enter the engine bay?