Hello all, i am a new member to club gti and am experiancing the same problem as the lot of you with the kr 16v and its doing my nut in..... I only bought my 16v yesterday and drove it back from where i bought it and it was fine, (with the exception of a bit of a struggle around the 4500rpm mark???) parked it up when i got home, jumped into it later started it and moved it on the drive. All seemed fine. This morning as i went out to start tidying it up this problem begun, i have spent most of the day trying to figure it out, spoke to some friends, one of which lead me to this site (dubstar!). Ive read thought all these posts, and links, tried MOST of the solutions listed and to no avail? Mine will start at the trun of the key, tick over for 2-3 seconds then die suddenly, as said earlier in this post it doesnt even drops slowley, it just cuts out. After reading these posts some of you seem to be able to get yours started after a few attempts but mine doesnt want to budge atall. Ive checked for vacum leaks, cleaned the isv (valve on top front right of head?) cleaned all the inlet, checked power to fuel pump, checked fuses and relays, air filter, ignition leads, dizzy cap etc. Have i missed anything it could be. Its really starting to annoy me now........as most of you guys by the sounds of it. Could it be anything to do with the timing?? Also, last thing (lol) a lot of you are going on about something caller WUR? Can someone please enlighten me as to what this is and where?? Thanks much very
From how I understand it, a dodgy accumulator would not affect the mixture unless the system pressurewas below the control pressure. If that was the case it'd never start! I ran a leaking accumulator for ages and never had starting problems. I would seriously suspect the feed and return lines from the WUR. There isn't a filter at the pump, and there is a good possibility that at some point a bit of crap has got past the main filter. I had this happen to me on my original (dx) engine. Worth blowing them through with an air line anyway. btw, i was measuring the pressures and had problems when system pressure crept over the maximum 5.4 bar reccomended for k-jet. 5.0 is book spec and 5.2 is probably a fair medium. imho.
and hi to the newbie! best off doing a few searches on the forum for WUR (warm up regulator) in the topic subject (to avoid the search timing out). there is also a very good manual available on-line.you should find a link somewhere on here. search for 'manual' - all in the engines section.
harry...the wur is a fag packet sized lump under the dist area..with 2 fuel hoses on it and a leccy connector as for mine, i left it last night not wanting to idle at all, today i noticed the return pipe was slightly leaking , i nipped it up and it idles now slightly differant now...the cold idle is up n down , i think maybe people call it hunting?? , so whatever ive done ive affected something btw stu...i also removed a 17mm nut on the fron of the metering head...like a needle with a sping on it, maybe worth cleaning yours...and another thought, maybe get a scrap banjo bolt and run the return direct into a petrol can to see if changes it
Thanks for all the replies, all good info. Will have a look at the shims on the pressure regulator, give it a clean, blow out the WUR fuel lines and give it a general going over and report back. Pigbladder - I think the needle valve thing you are talking about is the fuel pressure regulator, going to have a look at mine. Good idea about running the return line to a petrol can instead for testing purposes. As for the hunting idle, I've found in the past it's almost always due to a vacuum leak somewhere, either in the ISV piping or overun cut off valve. Sounds like it's improved since yesterday anyway - sure we'll both get our cars sorted out soon!
Also - Hi to Harry the newbie! As suggested above have a search on the forum for idling problems on 16v's. Most likely sounds like a vacuum leak, dirt in the air ducting from airbox to throttle body, dirty ISV or blocked fuel filter to me. Try and work through and check everything methodically.
oh and stu, before you run out and buy an accumulator...remeber mine was starting then stalling at the start of the thread, ive got it improved to a not perfect idle
which return pipe? a main fuel line or wur? if you've had any amount of leakage from the wur return line then that will have been affecting the mixture. note that you may have had a leak without it being visible (petrol evaporates very fast when under pressure). now you've fixed it you'll want to reset the mixture. i would seriously suspect that this is the root of your problem. other causes for hunting can be timing (but you've already ruled that out) or air leaks - specifically the vacuum feed to the ecu.
Good point! So your car is starting cold or hot ok now, just got a dodgy idle? Sounds like you are doing alright to me!
gti..i blew an airline down the metering head to tank pipe, and stupidly didnt check it was leak free when i re fitted it...i checked the mixture today stu..it seems all good aprt form cold idle bounces from 800-1200 , i do seem to have things slighly better
blow and air line down the wur lines too then, eh? then check your pressures with the guage you have (see my other post).
You misunderstood. I never said the accumulator would affect the mixture, I was refering to stu's cold starting problem, which as i've said have seen before and was found to be a dodgy accumulator - I cant seem to find the post though. Another cause for hunting is an over-rich CO setting, so its worth checking again if you have fixed leaks etc.
Hi again everyone, thanks for the warm welcome. After more investigations last night i think the problem with mine is the fuel pump, i think its breaking down slowley. If you put your hand on the pump and turn the ignition on it vibrates and buzzes then stops, them when u turn the key to start it should start vibrating and buzzing again right??? well mine aint vibrating and buzzing once the engine starts, therefore the first buzz is pumping a small amount of fuel into the engine, the engine starts on this bit of fuel then stalls almost immediatly. Im pretty sure this is my problem, but i want to check the relay to the pump before i change the pump as its a horrible job!lol Does anyone have any idea what number the relay for the fuel pump is as the wiring diagrams are far beyond my simple brain If this doesnt work them i think i will have to change the fuel pump and try again. Now nothing really to do with this post much but now i know what the WUR iscan someone tell me what the WUR mod is ir is it a big secret? lol Thanks for the help again. Spk swn
wur just sets the control pressure to 48psi at hot idle. have search if you want more info, but you do need a pressure guage for this. i should politely point out that we might be accused of hijacking this thread if we digress from pig and stu's problems too much! don't be afraid to start your own threads
mr gti, when i was at stealth, he had the gauge on my car and stated that it didnt need or he should do the wur mod.....somnething about the presure wouldve been thrown out when revved. he reved it and showed me the gauge he didnt say it was an issue, just that it shouldnt or couldnt be done on mine i was just wondering why mine didnt need it...sinse i kinda drove 2hrs to get it done any ideas
I've heard of some 16v's not needing/benefiting from the WUR mod before, pressumably they are already set up to run at optimum efficiency as standard or something like that? Mine certainly benefited from the WUR mod, mpg was improved alot and acceleration was noticably better. It was only the cold starting that went downhill!
Apologies for diverting the thread! Has anyone got any ideas about what i mentioned about the fuel pump and the original experianced problems??
this would be my guess too. they are quite sensitive and you can imagne that when they put the things together in the factory that they can't be arsed going round every car and testing the pressures. they'd just expect the factory tollerances of the mechanicals to be small enough that the car runs well without any 'tweaking'. like with factory heads, you get some especially good ones and some rather bad ones (out of the factory), but they are all 'good enough'. i presume that the guys at steath (vince?) checked the pressures when the engine was hot, but did they also do it when cold? and when warming up? if they ran it from cold then i would expect that they would have noticed if there was a problem, wouldn't you think?
