8 valve engines - OEM, tuned + race outputs

Discussion in '8-valve' started by A.N. Other, Feb 18, 2011.

  1. racer66 Forum Member

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    1798 cc 8thou skimmed head iirc Ian Carvell/Crissle built engine, running webber 45's, Shrick Cams, wossner pistons.

    Ran at SRR on 07/04/11

    165 bhp, 150 lb ft
     
  2. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    A little more on the Callaway:

    The article itself was about the 920bhp, 254.76mph Callaway Corvette Sledgehammer.
     
  3. mk1. Forum Junkie

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  4. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    1847cc perhaps with an 86.4 crank?

    http://www.clubgti.com/forum/showthread.php?t=228971


    Just grabbing the text in case it disappears:

     
  5. fthaimike Forum Addict

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    the original run of TSR 2.1's like what i still have are about 160bhp at 5600 / 154 torque at 5400

    you can sqeeze a few more bhp with some tweaking of a k-star unit, will see what mine is when it runs again
     
  6. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    217bhp @ 6750rpm 8V DX/2E

    Tatty Black and White Golf 2.0ltr 8v - 217bhp @ 6750rpm & 166lbs/ft torque @ 5000rpm [:D]

    DX head ex TSR 'D' pack, reworked by JMR and modified for Spiess 1991 F3 throttle bodies, 40.5/35 G&S valves and guides, Schrick 320 duration/13mm lift cam, Kent cams pulley wheel, Schrick double springs, titanium spring caps, Kent Cams Ford Cosworth followers and lash caps, SBD injectors, SBD TPS, MBE fuel and ignition ECU and loom, Wiseco 16v turbo slipper pistons and 2E block (machined to get squish correct) 13.5:1 compression, ABF head gasket (modified to suit), Std 159mm rods with ARP bolts, 12.9 main bearing cap bolts, ARP head stud kit, Windage tray, baffles and trap doors in std 2E sump, std 2E crank, MK4 Golf GTI crank sensor with external trigger wheel, Std genuine VW main, thrust and big end bearings., Std 2E oil pump and oick up, geared down alternator, heavily modified Ashley 4/1 manifold, Custom 2.5" system in to single silencer.
     
  7. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    That's quite a lot of output!
     
  8. mitlom

    mitlom Forum Member

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    8V GMS big valve head with Kent GS3 cam, vernier pulley, matched inlet and Audi throttle body, full Magnex system including 4-2-1 tubular manifold and lightened flywheel on a very very tired std 1800 bottom end with std K-jet.....

    142 bhp @ 6,130 RPM
    123 lbf ft @ 5,950 RPM

    300108Golfrollingroad.jpg

    Currently in the process of building a new 2ltr engine.......head being re-worked by JMR and fitted with Kent GS6 cam, matched twin DCOE Mangoletsi manifold, twin Jenvey 45 TBs, crank position sensor with crank mounted 36-1 trigger wheel, Emerald ECU, decked ABK block, modified Wiseco forged pistons (13:1 CR), 159mm forged H beam rods with ARP, ARP main stud and nut conversion, ARP head stud conversion, ACL race engine bearings, 'Hotgolf' lightened and balanced crank and flywheel, Schrick cast sump and windage tray.....
     
  9. retrowhore Forum Member

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    Just looked at the address on that Dyno plot. I used to go to 'Lamby's' all the time as a youngster. :thumbup:
     
  10. mitlom

    mitlom Forum Member

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    Yeah John was really helpfull. I just wanted to get it running right as I had just stuck that head on as I'd had it sitting on the shelf for nearly two years and thought I might as well make some use of it....I was quite surprised how much power it made considering the bottom end had probably done 100k or so and CR was not really high enough to make proper use of the cam installed!

    John reckons there was probably a little more to come but we were halted by the clutch going BANG...literally!

    I must try and get back up there sometime soon as I have dropped a RE1900 I have recently rebuilt into the Mk1 and want to get the fuelling and ignition set up properly! :thumbup:
     
  11. Ben S

    Ben S Forum Junkie

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    Used to live not far from Lambs in Clowne

    that graph looks quite modern as I remember no new machine with printouts but some ancient old dials instead & a hand scribbled output
     
  12. mitlom

    mitlom Forum Member

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    Yep Jan 2008
     
  13. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Sure is [:D]

    I'm really happy with the engine, we are really doing well in the Welsh Hillclimb/Sprint Championship this year, beating a lot of far more powerful and modern cars. Have attached a dyno print out of it's last run.

    Doing some cross referencing Hotgolf was on the same road earlier in the year with his 2.1 16v and we have very similar power and torque, he had 220bhp at the crank, mine 217bhp so that's a good reference. The 8v makes it's peak lower but the power curve is a similar. Again my Brother was on the same road in the afternoon with his Va****L XE engined GP4 Escort with QED 220 kit (cams, pistons, rod bolts etc.) 45's, MBE mapped ignition, Ashley GP4 manifold and system etc and that made 216bhp at the crank!

    I've developed this engine for 4 years now, when I first took it to Mosley's as an ex slick 50/Eurosaloons engine with a std TSR 'D' spec head, Shrick 304 cam, Mahle pistons, twin 45's, std Ashley race manifold and system plus MBE mapped ignition (carbs and ignition added after it's Eurosaloon days) it made 160bhp.

    [​IMG][/IMG]
     
  14. A.N. Other Banned after significant club disruption Dec 5th 2

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    Interesting to see the plot profile and the torque behaviour edit: as in on a fully breathed 8v. One perhaps to lay over some 8v data coming from the dyno tomorrow.

    Is the lower curve the LMA engine, or interim spec?
     
  15. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    The lower curve is the first run on the current engine. The LMA was running the MBE ECU but with an ignition only map, when we set up the new engine, to save time, we put a tarmac spec redtop map in and adjusted it to get it to run. I then put a few hundred road miles on it to bed it in.

    After that it went back on the rolling road and we adjusted the fueling to get it to run tidy. We had some issues low down as we had to go a bit over the top with the settings to get it to idle and it sat at about 1300rpm hot and the power dropped off too quick at the top end so after a bit of dissection of the readout we decided we needed to have another go once it had loosened up a bit.

    I ran it like this for the first half of the season, that is the lower readout on the graph above. I have a plot of the LMA (with carbs and mapped ignition) and the interim plot on the same printout, I'll copy it later and upload it as it is quite interesting. The LMA motor has a big gap between the torque and power peaks making it a very torquey engine where as the initial set up of this years engine had the torque and power peaks very close. When we set it up properly recently, as well as getting more of everything across the range, we moved the power and torque peaks apart by 1000 rpm making the engine more flexible.

    It now ticks over at 800rpm as smooth as you like, you could drive it down to Tescos and back with no problem, however it just wants to go, and revs very freely. It hits the 8k rev limited constantly as it doesn't drop off as it revs (when your racing you don't always watch the shift lights!). I'd let it run on more but I've not got steel rods in it yet so I keep it down to 8k at the moment.
     
  16. TonyB Paid Member Paid Member

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    Here you go, this is a plot showing the LMA engine, typical of the breed, TSR pack D head, Schrick 304 cam etc + twin 45's 4/1 manifold, MBE mapped ignition with a plot of the first run of the current full race engine. The one above shows the same race engine as built and then following some proper set up time to get the best from it. We saw a little more top end but at the expense of mid range so we sacrificed some top end for more mid range as we run on Hills and in Sprints. All figs are wheel BHP
    GolfDynorun2010.jpg
     
  17. Toyotec

    Toyotec CGTI Committee - Happy helper at large Admin

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    Maha unit usually = good curve - all things being equal.
     
  18. mitlom

    mitlom Forum Member

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    I was pleased and quite surprised with the results to be honest.....as stated the bottom end was very very tired and CR not really high enough for the 300deg cam :thumbup:
     
  19. DRV

    DRV Forum Member

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    A bit off topic.
    Is 217bhp @ 6750rpm 168lbs/ft?
     
  20. DRV

    DRV Forum Member

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    168,8 is more than 166lbs/ft torque @ 5000rpm

    Mistake in power output or...
     

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